Mocha Hitfilm

How to launch mocha in hitfilm 6 (new version 2018). I cant find it in effects panel.

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  • That's where it should be. In a folder/group called "Mocha by Imagineer systems". Are you sure you don't have something in the search field  which is limiting what you can see.

  • edited December 2017

    To be clear, are you using HitFilm Pro or did you buy the mocha plug-in for Express? Mocha is not otherwise available in the latest (or any) version of Express without  purchasing it as an add-on. 

    Also, "finding" and "launching" are two different things.  If you have Pro or the Express add-on, to find it, it should come up once you start typing "moc" in the effects panel search box. To launch it, after you drag and drop it onto your footage, twirl open the controls and click "Launch mocha UI." 

    If this does not work for you I would contact HitFilm support proper, because something is amiss. 

    Hope that is helpful.

  • Is Mocha also a part of Ignite Pro or only available for Hitfilm Pro (or as an Addon for "Express")? Ich can't find it in the feature list...

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @AndySeeon there is mo Mocha in Ignite. Ignite is a plug-in package to add Hitfilm features to other software like Vegas Pro, AVID, AE, etc... Imagineer already sells their own Mocha for other hosts. 

    Mocha Hitfilm is a specific subset of Mocha Pro bundled with Hitfilm Pro and available as an add-on for Express. 

  • @triem23 Thanks, that's what I thought

  • On the topic of mocha, anyone going to jump on that steep sale for the HitFilm plugin of mocha pro? ...just $295 until 1/31/18. I’m on the fence. I usually pounce when I have a particular project or idea mind.  I am assuming that the HitFilm mocha pro plugin does everything that the mocha pro stand alone does. Do I have that right?

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @Anthony2016 you are correct. The Mocha Pro plug-in does everything Mocha Pro does. 

  • @Triem23 if I wanted to use mocha pro for hitfilm and after effects which one would be better the standalone or the mocha pro plug in for hitfilm?

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @Andersen01498 let me get back to you on this. I haven't needed mocha pro in awhile, so I want to double check and see which modules render directly to timeline from the plug-in. 

  • @Triem23 thanks please let me know before the sale for mocha pro ends.

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @Andersen01498 Here's the deal. The Plug in version basically has all functionality of the Standalone version except for stereoscopic video, 360 video (requires Mocha VR) and python scripting. For hundreds of dollars less. Otherwise, you can export tracking and spline data for Ae, export stabilization data for AE, maybe export Lens Data for AE (I didn't do a lens correction), and render final video from the insert, remove, stabiliation and lens modules. Get the plug-in.

  • @Triem23 are you planning to do some tutorials on the Hitfilm Academy for Mocha Pro?

    Just today I bought the Mocha Pro plug-in as the price was too tempting and I know that it can be a huge help with current and future projects. 
    For now I watch their tutorials on their Youtube channel to get a feel for it. In fact it doesn't matter if you use AE or Hitfilm. The handling stays the same, I guess.

  • where might I find information about this Mocha Pro sale? I haven't been able to find anything thus far

  •  @Juda1 thank you so much

  • I would have to say I got an email about the sale but otherwise hitfilm has been really quiet about mocha pro plugin sale...

     

  • @Anderson01498 having double-checked my inbox now I see I got an email about it as well. I just hadn't noticed it

  • But for the people that don't have email they have been really quiet

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @MarioKluser that's an "Eventually" thing. Right now I'm something like 6 tutorials behind on where I wanted to be in October! And I'm just behind in general.

    Right now, I really need to get in and finish up the pending Express tutorials to get into Pro-only tutorials. When I (eventually) get to Mocha it will be as thorough as the Hitfilm tutorials (so, like a huge tutorial just on the interface, etc).

    As you've noted, the Ae-based tutorials from Imagineer cover the software well, and the only real differences between Mocha Pro in Ae vs Hitfilm are exporting hfcs shots to re-import to Hitfilm vs copying to the Ae clipboard. 

    So I'll get there, but it'll be a while. 

    Minor correction: my channel is Hitfilm University. There actually is a Hitfilm Academy channel run by a young lad named Max out of the UK. He's pretty good, and, if he sticks with VFX he'll be really good by the time he hits adulthood. :)

    The current sale--Hitfilm sent out one email, but that's really Imagineer's baby. 

  • Seems a very interesting offer. Is the FBX Camera export also available in this version?

  • @Rocker_IX there is a free trial, I strongly recommend that you check it out and I believe so that there is an option for fbx camera 

  • @Andersen01498

    Thanks for your reply.

    I know that there is an FBX export as I found it on their website in the feature description. I just want to be sure that it's not cut out from the pro version for Hitfilm. There is a chance that this was cut from this version as it's more oriented towards composting tools than external 3D software like Lightwave.

    As I saw here some people here have already upgraded, perhaps someone can check if the feature is included?

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @Rocker_lx the export formats for camera solves are AE 3D data, Hitfilm Composite Shot, FBX and FBX for Nuke.

    Layer tracking data exports in a lot of Ae formats, Assimalate, Boris,Fusion, Avid, Final Cut, Hitfilm, Blender, nuke, quantel, shake,...

    Shape data in Premiere, Combustion, Fusion, Hitfilm, Nuke, Shake, AE and Final Cut...

    And a few others.

  • Great, Thank you.

     

  • Well, I've gone and done it. I purchased mocha Pro for HitFilm.  I am quite excited about it. 

  • @Anthony2016

    Maybe you want to pump out some tutorials on Mocha Pro if you are so excited.

    There are some hair locks that give me headache in chroma keying, so I decided to remove them....

    ....Hours of tutorials later I still had no success and come to the conclusion that if I just had key framed a mask within Hitfilm, all the work would have been done already.

    Mocha just acts in unexpected ways. Totally different than in the tutorials I watch. Sometimes the everything on the Remove tab is inactive and after clicking aimlessly on other things the stuff is active again and I don't know what I did.

    As soon as I figure things out I will create some tutorials myself. At this point I'm disappointed, as I have some dead lines and the learning curve is to steep in order to use the the plug-in as a time saver.

  • edited January 30

    Sorry to hear you’re having trouble with the mocha Pro plugin, @MarioKluser. I am by no means an expert in the software, but I have waded through a good number of tutorials on Pro and have some ideas which you may or may not know or find helpful:

    • If you don’t have enough information in your footage for a good key, you probably don’t have enough information for a good remove using the parameters. Most of the remove parameters in some fashion work by pulling information from elsewhere in the scene. As such, a clean plate remove is your best bet. I would focus on tutorials that show you how to use the clean plate remove (the ones I’ve seen are very brief). If you didn’t take a viable one during the shoot, you could create a clean plate by taking a frame from your footage, exporting it to tweak in something like Photoshop, importing back in, and telling mocha to use it, and only it, simply by checking the self-explanatory box.
    • Depending on how troublesome your scene is after a clean plate remove, (like awkward lighting and/or shadows that are hard to mask out) you may need to use those other parameters to tweak the image further. This does indeed seem like a huge trial and error venture, and highly dependent on the unique aspects of the footage.
    • The most important step (of a few important steps) in a remove is getting a good background track. Everything is built on that (your foreground mask is literally linked to it).
    • In terms of workflow, you may want to edit the duration of your clip first. No need to track for a remove the frames you will not be using. It may look fine in a part of the scene you would use, and you could waste time trying to get the remove right in a portion of the scene you are not even going to use. Either edit first, or set your in and out points in mocha to capture what you know you will use.
    • If you are willing and able, I would post your difficulties on the mocha Pro forum at Boris FX. They seem helpful, and I’ve even seen them make a tutorial of difficult to track footage as a case example. Likewise, I’m sure the HitFilm forum might be able to help you sort through the remove.
    • You are not alone. Hair is notoriously difficult to key well. It’s sounds like it is too late for this project, but a good key largely begins in principal photography. The basic idea is to separate the subject from an evenly lit background. Similarly, a camera with good chroma subsampling is a must. Ideally, this would be 4:4:4, but you could get by with 4:2:2; a chroma subsampling of 4:2:0 is not going to work well, particular with the likes of hair. Lighting and chroma subsampling are the foundations of pulling a good (or miserable) key; this is where that useful information down the line in post is derived.

    I would also validate your notion of needing to understand the software better. The quality of mocha may seem to vary, but its actually pretty solid (Academy Award winning solid). It's used in major motion pictures that have deadlines, high expectations (as in a lot of money riding on their output), and don't mess around with unreliable products. Variation is very much dependent on footage variation (as in not exactly like what tutorials were based on); and footage quality is very much dependent on footage composition and information (chroma subsampling,  resolution, from rate, etc.).

    Also, masking out the problematic hair locks in HitFilm would work too! (smile)

    Anyway, if I were to make a tutorial on the issue you mentioned with mocha, it would likely contain some of this information.

    Hope that is helpful! 

     

  • Anthony_VFX_CGI 

    The background is actually very easy to track since the footage is inside a car that stands in front of a green screen. The problem is that the actress has blond and flimsy hair. Every time she turns hear head to her co-actor there are some locks that are hard to key out.

    I followed some tutorials for MockaPro with the clean plate, but overall it's still too time consuming. In the hours it took me to dig all that, I could have fix the problem with a key framed mask in Hitfilm Pro.

    I will use Mocha Pro for other scenes and especially for another project. 
    A day after my purchase Mike from BorisFX called me b.t.w. and asked if everything is working fine. He then sent me his contacts in case I run into a snag in the future. Great service.

    At this moment I'm back in the chroma key effect and try to figure out if the despill mask can help me in any way to this flimsy hair keyed out. The Despill Mask, while mentioned in the manual, hasn't been been touched in any video tutorial I found so far. Therefore it is a trial and error again.

    But I will prevail :-)

     

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @MarioKluser I'm curious--what's your camera that you shot with?

    I'm just going to point to this video and suggest you watch it. It's about testing one's camera, He'll test here a GH4, 6D and BMCC--not how the different recording codecs hold detail better.

    In short, if you're camera is something like a mirrorless or DSLR recording to it's memory card slot, it's recording highly compressed h.264 (which compresses in 8x8 pixel blocks) in a 4:2:0 color space. In short, you've got terrible edges to deal with and might NOT really be able resolve those edges.

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